Which vitamin E supplement do you/would you prefer, Healthnatura’s or Haidut’s or something else?

[Logan-]

***This is from healthnatura:

Whole E 2oz

healthnatura.com

$70

***Haidut’s product

TocoVit - Liquid Vitamin E From Wheat Germ Oil

Edit (January 25, 2023): Just a quick note that we have changed the TocoVit formulation to no longer use MCT oil as the solvent/dilutent. Instead, TocoVit now uses extra-virgin organic olive oil (EVOOO) - the same oil used as a solvent in one of the Kuinone formulations. Everything else remains...

raypeatforum.com

$40


***Purebulk sells it, the powder form is very cheap. I’m considering mixing it with EVOO in my house. What do you think about that product?

D-Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate Powder (Vitamin E) (700 IU)

Vitamin E is collective term describing a group of antioxidant compounds called tocopherols and tocotrienols. Get yours at PureBulk, Inc.

purebulk.com

Extremely cheap. Is d-alpha tocopheryl acetate a good form or not?

Which one would you prefer?
Do you know of any other good vitamin E product?

 

[Logan-]

Does anybody know how much vitamin E a progest-E bottle contains, and what forms are used?

Does Katherine/Kenogen still sell Progest-E? How much vitamin e is in Progest-E?

Does Katherine/Kenogen as a company still sell Progest-E directly to costumers? My thread in 2021: https://raypeatforum.com/community/threads/which-website-to-buy-progest-e-from.42104/ Does anyone know how much vitamin E is in Progest-E?

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

Ray had mentioned this company as a decent source of Vitamin E in an email.

He wouldn't say which one he uses, but hinted to mixed tocopherols with the highest delta.

Does anyone know which of their products has the highest delta?

Vitamin E | ADM

Open to anyone's experience with any of their Vitamin E sources as well.

 

[PopSocket]

Haiduts in my view is the best and I trust that he does his homework which is important. And I feel great taking it. With the others one is looking at a faceless brand.

 

[Logan-]

Thorne Ultimate-E Vs. Carlson E-Gems Vs. TocoVit Please Help!

Hi there. Which one is the best price wise? Thorne Ultimate E (Mixed tocopherols only): Vitamin E 500 IU €38.77 - 60 servings (gelcaps) Derived from various oils including soybean oil I cannot verify if their product is GMO or not. Please examine their quality page to make a verdict...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

Great study on Vitamin E Succinate at https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2394445/pdf/89-6601360a.pdf

"The unique structural features of agents like a-TOS probably make them selective for malignant cells (Neuzil et al, 2001b). While speculative at present, it is possible that the surprisingly high toxicity of a-TOS towards cancer cells and tissues is due to their persistence in such cells in the original form, while normal cells, including fibroblasts (Roberg et al, 1999), cardiac myocytes (Roberg and Ollinger, 1998), hepatocytes (Tirmenstein et al, 1999) and intestinal epithelial cells (Borel et al, 2001), are all capable of its hydrolysis to a-TOH"

"There are several reports documenting that the VE analogue potentiates cancer cells killing by the immunological apoptogen Fas, viz by mobilising the Fas receptor from the cytosol to the plasma membrane; this has been shown for both prostate and breast cancer cells (Turley et al, 1997; Yu et al, 1999). These findings suggest that a-TOS has the propensity to boost the immune system to enhance cancer surveillance. While the Fas ligand itself is highly cytotoxic, the TNF-related apoptosis inducing ligand (TRAIL) is selective for cancer cells (Bonavida et al, 1999). Therefore, the reports that a-TOS can potentiate cancer cells to killing by TRAIL may be of pharmacological importance. This has been shown for both colon cancer (Weber et al, 2002) and mesothelioma cells (Neuzil et al, unpublished) as well as for T lymphoma cells (Dalen and Neuzil, 2003)"

"Finally, a-TOS can sensitise cancer cells by upregulation of the TRAIL death receptors, as in the TRAIL resistant mesothelioma cells (Neuzil et al, unpublished"

"Probably, the strongest evidence suggesting the potential use of VE analogues in the treatment of humans with neoplastic disease comes from the laboratory of Malafa. They first showed that a-TOS promoted beast cancer dormancy in an immunocompromised mouse (Malafa and Neitzel, 2000) and, later on, also melanoma dormancy (Malafa et al, 2002b); in both cases, inhibition of angiogenesis via suppression of VEGF signaling by a-TOS was suggested as the underlying mechanism, pointing to an indirect effect of the VE analogue on cancer growth."

"Perhaps, the most exciting aspect of the potential use of compounds like a-TOS, a pro-VE, follows from its pharmacokinetics. After infusion into the circulatory system, the VE analogue associates with circulating lipoproteins (Kayden and Traber, 1993; Pussinen et al, 2000). This carrier delivers it to the microvasculature of the tumour. Since there is a constant exchange of hydrophobic molecules between lipoproteins and the peripheral tissue, a-TOS can traverse to malignant cells, where it induces apoptosis (Neuzil, 2002). Due to rapid turnover of lipoproteins (Traber et al, 1994), a-TOS is eventually cleared in the liver. Hepatocytes have a high activity of nonspecific esterases that cleave the VE ester to a-TOH. Further, during processing of lipoproteins in the liver cells, the natural stereoisomer of a-TOH associates with the highly specific a-TOH-binding protein, which inserts this most active form of VE into nascent very low-density lipoprotein that is, in turn, rescreeted into circulation via the hepatic vein (Terasawa et al, 2000). In this way, following hydrolysis of a-TOS, the circulation is enriched with VE. Therefore, the pro-VE, a-TOS and similar compounds (Birringer et al, 2003) are converted to the redox-active VE with additional beneficial activity (Neuzil, 2002), including increased protection against oxidative stress and immunosuppressive activity (LiWeber et al, 2002). Moreover, several reports showed that a-TOS Vitamin E succinate and cancer J Neuzil 1824 British Journal of Cancer (2003) 89(10), 1822–1826 & 2003 Cancer Research UK protects cells like hepatocytes from secondary deleterious effects of toxic agents, including adriamycin (Dominguez-Rodriguez et al, 2001; Fariss et al, 2001)."

I would say Vitamin E Succinate is the way to go!

Is Supplementing Vit E Actually Bad For You?

Sorry John. This is what I was concluding to "Antioxidants work for prevention but not for deactivation of cancer cells..." Context is everything... Cool Obi, that I understand...plus that statement gives me a starting point if I want to research further...thanks

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

So if going by these studies for cancer then alpha tocopherol succinate is likely optimal, followed by mixed tocopherols high in gamma, & dl-alpha tocopherol acetate form could have opposite effects. not sure about dl-alpha

The different impact between Vitamin E forms on cancer growth

estrogen stimulated breast cancer (desirable effect from alpha, delta, gamma, or gamma mixed tocopherols) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5337152/ 0.2% of diet (>1g tocopherol human?) alpha slowed estrogen cancer, gamma and delta performed better. but mixed tocopherols high in...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

Check this out. It's the one I'm using right now:

PureBulk Supplements

Thorne Ultimate-E Vs. Carlson E-Gems Vs. TocoVit Please Help!

Hi there. Which one is the best price wise? Thorne Ultimate E (Mixed tocopherols only): Vitamin E 500 IU €38.77 - 60 servings (gelcaps) Derived from various oils including soybean oil I cannot verify if their product is GMO or not. Please examine their quality page to make a verdict...

raypeatforum.com

Acid Succinate Powder (Vitamin E)

Vitamin E Acid Succinate is a powderized Vitamin E supplement that contains an ester form of d-alpha tocopherol combined with succinic acid.

purebulk.com

 

[Ismail]

Just my two cents:

I've really started to lean towards Dr Barrie Tan's research and work on Vitamin E, in specific, his work on tocotrienols.

Not sure if anyone else has come across his work?

Quite fascinating - I'm currently taking a product which contains the vitamin E (tocotrienol) that his company makes - Dr Tan doesn't sell products directly to consumers.

Here's a recent interview of his:


View: https://youtu.be/xqG0J7tMCEQ?si=X9kRlm_ACiVRaSO8

 

[LazloC]

Just my two cents:

I've really started to lean towards Dr Barrie Tan's research and work on Vitamin E, in specific, his work on tocotrienols.

Not sure if anyone else has come across his work?

Quite fascinating - I'm currently taking a product which contains the vitamin E (tocotrienol) that his company makes - Dr Tan doesn't sell products directly to consumers.

Here's a recent interview of his:


View: https://youtu.be/xqG0J7tMCEQ?si=X9kRlm_ACiVRaSO8

Yes, I have heard him speak several times in person at conferences. The research behind it is pretty amazing. But the thing is you need some alpha-tocopherol to help with PUFA oxidation, but you need to take it several hours away from the Delta tocotrienols or it inhibits their absorption.

Check out the research at www.barrietan.com

 

[Ismail]

But the thing is you need some alpha-tocopherol to help with PUFA oxidation,

Oh ok, I thought the tocotrienols would do the same/similar thing. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, much appreciated.

 

[LazloC]

Oh ok, I thought the tocotrienols would do the same/similar thing. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, much appreciated.

Yes, I have learned differently myself.

 

[Logan-]

What do you think of this vitamin e powder:

Acid Succinate Powder (Vitamin E)

Vitamin E Acid Succinate is a powderized Vitamin E supplement that contains an ester form of d-alpha tocopherol combined with succinic acid.

purebulk.com

Here’s a CoA shared on that link, what do you think about it?

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0012/6379/6273/files/Vitamin_E_Acid_Succinate._Rep._COA.pdf?v=1700063514

It says non-GMO, highly refined soybean.


Do you think the acid succinate powder is better than d-alpha tocopherol acetate powder (D-Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate Powder (Vitamin E) (700 IU))?

 

[Logan-]

What do you think of this vitamin e powder:

Acid Succinate Powder (Vitamin E)

Vitamin E Acid Succinate is a powderized Vitamin E supplement that contains an ester form of d-alpha tocopherol combined with succinic acid.

purebulk.com

Here’s a CoA shared on that link, what do you think about it?

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0012/6379/6273/files/Vitamin_E_Acid_Succinate._Rep._COA.pdf?v=1700063514

It says non-GMO, highly refined soybean.


Do you think the acid succinate powder is better than d-alpha tocopherol acetate powder (D-Alpha Tocopheryl Acetate Powder (Vitamin E) (700 IU))?

Magnesium Succinate

Ray Peat recommends the succinate form of magnesium for several applications including heavy metal detox. I have found many magnesiums that include succinate as one of a variety of forms, but none that are exclusively magnesium succinate. Does anyone know of a commercial brand of magnesium...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

Search “succinate” in the forum:

Search results for query: Succinate

raypeatforum.com

From what I have read, succinate is the way to go; not the acetate form.

 

[BrianF]

I firmly believe in the quality of Haidut's products, I have been a regular buyer for a number of years.

 

[Logan-]

Vitamin E succinate induces NAG-1 expression in a p38 kinase-dependent mechanism.
Shim M, Eling TE.
Eicosanoids Biochemistry Section, Laboratory of Molecular Carcinogenesis,
National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences, NIH, 111 T.W. Alexander
Drive, Research Triangle Park, NC 27709, USA.

"NAG-1 (nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drug-activated gene), a member of the
transforming growth factor-beta superfamily, is involved in many cellular
processes, such as inflammation, apoptosis/survival, and tumorigenesis. Vitamin E
succinate (VES) is the succinate derivative of alpha-tocopherol and has
antitumorigenic activity in a variety of cell culture and animal models. In the
current study, the regulation and role of NAG-1 expression in PC-3 human prostate
carcinoma cells by VES was examined. VES treatment induced growth arrest and
apoptosis as well as an increase in NAG-1 protein and mRNA levels in a time- and
concentration-dependent manner. VES treatment induced nuclear translocation and
activation of p38 kinase. Pretreatment with p38 kinase inhibitor blocked the
VES-induced increase in NAG-1 protein and mRNA levels, whereas an inhibition of
protein kinase C, Akt, c-Jun NH(2)-terminal kinase, or MEK activity had no effect
on VES-induced NAG-1 levels. Forced expression of constitutively active MKK6, an
upstream kinase for p38, induced an increase in NAG-1 promoter activity, whereas
p38 kinase inhibitor blocked MKK6-induced increase in NAG-1 promoter activity.
VES treatment resulted in >3-fold increase in the half-life of NAG-1 mRNA in a
p38 kinase-dependent manner and transient transfection experiment showed that VES
stabilizes NAG-1 mRNA through AU-rich elements in 3'-untranslated region of NAG-1
mRNA. The inhibition of NAG-1 expression by small interfering RNA significantly
blocked VES-induced poly(ADP-ribose) polymerase cleavage, suggesting that NAG-1
may play an important role in VES-induced apoptosis. These results indicate that
VES-induced expression of NAG-1 mRNA/protein is regulated by
transcriptional/post-transcriptional mechanism in a p38 kinase-dependent manner
and NAG-1 can be chemopreventive/therapeutic target in prostate cancer."

Vitamin E Succinate Induces NAG-1 Expression In A P38 Kinase

Vitamin E succinate induces NAG-1 expression in a p38 kinase-dependent mechanism. Shim M, Eling TE. Eicosanoids Biochemistry Section, Laboratory of Molecular Carcinogenesis, National Institute of Environmental Health Sciences, NIH, 111 T.W. Alexander Drive, Research Triangle Park, NC 27709, USA...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

I have already posted a study about vitamin E succinate (VES) beeing able to decrease liver carcinoma by 77%
(Vitamin E Succinate Very Effective Against Liver Carcinoma ,acetate Form Increases It)


There have previously been studies on VES and melanoma in vitro and they all showed decreases in tumor, while other kinds of vitamin E where not effective.

"However, other forms of vitamin E such as DL-alpha-tocopherol free alcohol, Aquasol DL-alpha-tocopherol acetate, DL-alpha-tocopherol nicotinate, or sodium succinate with an equivalent volume of ethanol, at similar concentrations, were ineffective."
(Effects of tocopherol (vitamin E) acid succinate on morphological alterations and growth inhibition in melanoma cells in culture - PubMed)
(Inhibition of angiogenesis and promotion of melanoma dormancy by vitamin E succinate - PubMed)



Now this study looked at the in vivo effect of VES on melanoma in mice .
They found that :

"Tumors in the control groups grew rapidly, reaching an average volume of
2350 ± 798 µL by day 15 after the inoculation of
B16F10 melanoma cells. In contrast, the inhibition of tumor growth on mice that were administered VES intraperitoneally was profound, with tumor volume remaining at an average of 367 ± 136 µL (Fig 2, A and B)."

That's a tumor size difference of 650% !
I have attached a picture of the tumor in vivo. It's a bit TMI so ,be warned.
The mouse on the left has the untreated melanoma , on the right melanoma treated with VES . It looks like the difference of an orange to a pea.

They also looked at the apoptosis rate in the tumor cells , which increased by 58 % :

"Melanoma tumors from VES-treated mice demonstrated a statistically significant increase in apoptosis compared with those from the control (76% ± 9% vs 18% ± 1%, P = .0256, Fig 3, B, Fig 4)."

Vitamin E inhibits melanoma growth in mice - PubMed

This is the first report of the antimelanoma effect of VES in vivo. The mechanism of the antimelanoma effect of VES in vivo involves the promotion of tumor cell apoptosis. These findings support future investigations of VES as a therapeutic micronutrient against melanoma.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Extremely exciting. Are you aware of any hypothesises why a-tocopherol-succinate does what it does while seemingly similar substances (E alc, other Esters, Succ Acid alone) don’t?
Thanks for sharing @Mauritio

You're welcome. No I dont . I actually stumbled upon these studies because I asked ray a question on vitamin E and the androgen receptor . So this would be my follow up question...

I used the nutricology brand before . I liked it ,but it had some nasty fillers . So now I'm using the pure bulk powder , it has no fillers and I dont get allergic symptoms from it .

Acid Succinate Powder (Vitamin E)

Vitamin E Acid Succinate is a powderized Vitamin E supplement that contains an ester form of d-alpha tocopherol combined with succinic acid.

purebulk.com

I asked Ray on why there is such convincing evidence for the succinate type :

Q: I found studies showing beneficial effects against liver carcinoma and melanoma ,but in both cases only the succinate type was effective , no other type of Vitamin E .
Do you know why that is?

A: I think succinate might be functioning in a detoxifying reaction, increasing glucuronic acid.

I wonder why d-alpha-tocopherol and mixed tocoperols were not tested. Is it because testing synthetic and esterified Vitamin E aganstt natural vitamin E is against establishment policy?

I'm surprised that Ray did not ask why natural vitamin E wasn't used at all to compare with the synthetic succinate. Perhaps he was focused on the succinate as the reason for the success of the vitamin E succinate.

What im wondering about is why he is kind of avoiding a final stance on the succinate form . He avoided a direct answer when asked during a Q&A and also during an email that I send him ...

Vitamin E succinate decreases melanoma size by 650% in vivo

I have already posted a study about vitamin E succinate (VES) beeing able to decrease liver carcinoma by 77% (Vitamin E Succinate Very Effective Against Liver Carcinoma ,acetate Form Increases It) There have previously been studies on VES and melanoma in vitro and they all showed decreases in...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Logan-]

The only thing that worries me is that peat called succinic acid "potentially toxic " because it can increase chelation of some metals I think.

 

[Logan-]

Those 2 brands dont list any bad fillers .

Amazon product ASIN B00068TC96View: https://www.amazon.com/Swanson-Natural-Vitamin-Milligrams-Capsules/dp/B00068TC96/ref=mp_s_a_1_13?dchild=1&keywords=vitamin+e+succinate&qid=1630759356&sr=8-13#aw-udpv3-customer-reviews_feature_div


Amazon product ASIN B08451BX1MView: https://www.amazon.com/Vitamin-Vitamin-Succinate-Tocopheryl-Succinate-D/dp/B08451BX1M/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?dchild=1&keywords=vitamin+e+succinate&qid=1630759524&sr=8-4