Remarkable Synergistic Effect Of Androsterone With DHEA

[Lokzo]

Using androsterone crashes my libido, but makes me feel androgenic in other areas (mood, voice, muscular power). I feel like it drops estrogen too low.

 

[Cameron]

Using androsterone crashes my libido, but makes me feel androgenic in other areas (mood, voice, muscular power). I feel like it drops estrogen too low.

How much you take?

 

[Healthia]

I think it is worth cycling as androsterone is a prohormone to DHT and other androgens. Also, androsterone itself and these androgens can all inhibit estrogen synthesis and if it becomes too low it can cause symptoms. As Ray said, steroids fat away from the original source (cholesterol/pregnenolone) should be used sparingly and in lower doses. The 10mg daily dose is probably OK, especially when used with Pansterone but you may also want to try androsterone only combined with say 100mg oral pregnenolone.

@haidut Based on your comments about Estrogen above I’m looking for a bit of advice. A little background. 53 year-old male. Lowish testosterone about a year and half ago 4.50 ng/ml. Switched to mostly Peat diet, not super strict. And added Vitamin D, Magnesium, Vitamin A, Vitamin E, Zinc, Vitamin k2 (MK4 and Mk7), calcium, and Boron. The changes brought my Total Test up to almost 6.00 ng/ml which is fairly decent for my age. I would however like to optimize a bit more. I started using Pansterone about a week ago (8 drops 2-3 times per day) and have started to notice a slight increase in libido but would like it a bit higher. I’d like to try the Pansterone and the Androsterone together but my concern (after reading some of your comments about lowering estrogen) is that my Estrogen is already low. I’m wondering if I bump the Pansterone a bit higher than 15mg a day, that more would convert to Estrogen? which I would like to be a little higher. Any other thoughts or comments on my blood work would be appreciated. At my age I am trying to increase libido and androgens. I also know next to nothing about Thyroid so any comments advice on optimizing would be greatly appreciated. Seems like my Prolactin is a bit high. All blood work below is about two weeks old.


TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 5.92 ng/mL Range 3.00-10.00 ng/mL

TESTOSTERONE FREE 114.1 pg/mL Range 35.0 - 155.0 pg/mL

TESTOSTERONE FREE % 1.9 %
Range 1.1 - 2.8 %

MAGNESIUM 2.1 mg/dL
Range 1.6 - 2.6 mg/dL

TSH,BLD,QN 2.480 uIU/mL
Range 0.300 - 4.200 uIU/mL

T4 FREE 1.20 ng/mL
Range 0.60 - 1.70 ng/mL

T3 101.0 ng/dL
Range 80.0 - 200.0 ng/dL

SHGB 30 nmol/L
Range 10 - 50 nmol/L

PROLACTIN 15.0 ng/mL
Range Males (>18 years): 2.0 - 18.0 ng/mL

ESTRADIOL 12.0 pg/mL
Range Males 11.3-43.2

PROGESTERONE 0.27 ng/mL
Range Males 0.3 - 1.2 ng/mL

FERRITIN 92.8 ng/mL
Range 30.0 - 400.0 ng/mL

25-HYDROXYVITAMIN D 91 ng/mL
Range 30 - 100 ng/mL

ALT 35 U/L
Range <=41 U/L


CHOLESTEROL 254 mg/dL
Range <=200 mg/dL


TRIGLYCERIDE 222 mg/dL
Range <=150 mg/dL


CHOLESTEROL, NON-HDL 214 mg/dL Range <=130 mg/dL


LDL 170 mg/dL
Range <=100 mg/dL


GLUCOSE POST FAST 97 mg/dL
Range 70 - 100 mg/dL

POTASSIUM 4.5 mmol/L
Range 3.6 - 5.2 mmol/L

SODIUM 142 mmol/L
Range 136 - 145 mmol/L

CHLORIDE 104 mmol/L
Range 98 - 107 mmol/L

CO2 26 mmol/L
Range 22 - 29 mmol/L

ANION GAP SERPL 12
Range 8 - 16

CREATININE 1.04 mg/dL
Range 0.70 - 1.20 mg/dL

BUN 23 mg/dL
Range 6 - 20 mg/dL

GLOMERULAR FILTRATION RATE, NONAFRICAN AMERICAN >60 mL/min >=60 mL/min

 

[BrianF]

Began using Androsterone again about three weeks ago. Noticed some differences in effect to taking it with Pansterone as I did in the past. As expected more alert, decisive, energetic, muscle growth. But this time, its more 'edgy'. Maybe its increased my DHT too high?

Been dropping 2-3 drops in my belly-button (I read somewhere that this would be better way of dosing, as direct to the scrotum might lower my natural production). I have been taking an vitamin B based energy supplement (berocca style) in the morning at same time as I dose my Andro - I also read that this would maximise Testosterone production. Considering dropping it to 1 drop.

I have a bottle of Progestene that I bought for my girlfriend (that she seems reluctant to try) and I'm considering adding that to the protocol to try to get a synergy similar to the pansterone. Is this a sensible presumption?

Been reading that Prog is used by body builders as a oestrogen blocker, might I even be able to raise testosterone through Prog, and easing off on the androsterone?

 

[rzero]

Digging into the details of this study:

It shows that the most androgenic effect was actually achieved with androsterone alone, without DHEA. Also, mixture that achieved the arbitrarily chosen androgenic level with the least amount of steroid used was 100% androsterone, 0% DHEA. This "mixture" was not ranked #1 though because the 25%/75% mixture used less androsterone, even though the total amount of steroid used including the DHEA was higher.

To me, these details suggest the possibility that 100% androsterone is the way to go if one is looking for androgenicity.

I'd be interested if anyone has any thoughts or updates on experimentation.

 

[opethfeldt]

I noticed the steroid used in the study is "dehydroISOandrosterone". DHEA is an abbreviation for "dehydroEPIandrosterone". Are they the same steroid? Can't seem to find anything about the former.

 

[rzero]

I noticed the steroid used in the study is "dehydroISOandrosterone". DHEA is an abbreviation for "dehydroEPIandrosterone". Are they the same steroid? Can't seem to find anything about the former.

I noticed this. From what I could tell from a quick search, they are the same thing.

 

[Velve921]

So I've been playing with the following combination the past 72 hours:

1 : 1 : 1 ratio of Androsterone:Pansterone:5a-DHP

It's the most surreal combination of calmness I think I've ever tried. I feel so chill that my mind kind of feels like mush on some levels.

It's kind of hard to explain actually but its intense.

 

[Waynish]

So I've been playing with the following combination the past 72 hours:

1 : 1 : 1 ratio of Androsterone:Pansterone:5a-DHP

It's the most surreal combination of calmness I think I've ever tried. I feel so chill that my mind kind of feels like mush on some levels.

It's kind of hard to explain actually but its intense.

So many potential combinations & delivery methods. Did you put them on the belly together?

 

[Velve921]

So many potential combinations & delivery methods. Did you put them on the belly together?

scrotum.

 

[Frankdee20]

Digging into the details of this study:

It shows that the most androgenic effect was actually achieved with androsterone alone, without DHEA. Also, mixture that achieved the arbitrarily chosen androgenic level with the least amount of steroid used was 100% androsterone, 0% DHEA. This "mixture" was not ranked #1 though because the 25%/75% mixture used less androsterone, even though the total amount of steroid used including the DHEA was higher.

To me, these details suggest the possibility that 100% androsterone is the way to go if one is looking for androgenicity.

I'd be interested if anyone has any thoughts or updates on experimentation.

Isn’t the issue potentially with Androsterone alone the conversion into DHT, which can lower total T ?

 

[rzero]

Isn’t the issue potentially with Androsterone alone the conversion into DHT, which can lower total T ?

Perhaps. I'm just going by the details of the study. I forgot to mention that even the curve of 50%/50% mixture is just about to flatten out and go down like the rest of them as the dose is increased. But raising DHT at the expense of lowering T may still raise androgenicity according to certain measures. But I'll agree that doesn't mean it is necessarily desirable.

 

[jtoro]

I use androsterone mostly because it is a precursor to DHT and I like to take precursors instead of direct hormones whenever possible. But in cases where metabolis is compromised and the steroid enzymes are not working well, or if there is an excess of cortisol/estrogen/prolactin one may need to use 11-keto DHT to bring things under control. You should not be doing something just because I am doing it. You should try things yourself and do what works best for you.

Can androestrone lower libido?

 

[Frankdee20]

Can androestrone lower libido?

Yes

 

[GreekDemiGod]

Would Andro be suitable to be used standalone? Anything to watch out for, except too low estrogen symptoms.

 

[Mitchell777]

I would apply on the skin or take orally. Probably too much T and DHT to dissolve properly in a bottle of Pansterone, but could work if heated well. If it is the SFA/ethanol version some of the ethanol will evaporate when heated so you may need to add more to make it back into 15ml volume. If it is the tocopherol/MCT version then no need to add anything.

Hello Georgi,

Just a quick question regarding the response you provided above. Does this in effect mean, if one could source raw androstanalone and raw, base testosterone powder, you could simply add the correct quantity of powder for each respective steroid powder to a bottle of pansterone? I assume the method would be a as simple as emptying a full bottle of pansterone into glass beaker for example, then adding the quantity of raw androstanalone and raw testosterone as desired, and mixing? Or would any added solvents / mixed tocopherols etc needed to be added? Apologies if that’s a stupid question, I just want some clarification on dissolving raw powders into an already formulated product such as pansterone.

Thanks

@haidut

 

[Mitchell777]

Awesome, so do you think a bottle of pansterone with your current formula's solvents would be able to dissolve 450 mg T and 180 mg DHT? That would be perfect, so every 4 drops would contain 5 mg T and 2 mg DHT, along with 5mg DHEA and Preg. Then extra pregnenolone could be supplemented as necessary.

Do you think this DHT/T/DHEA/Preg solution would be best applied to the scrotum? Or would a smaller amount be more appropriate if applied there? Maybe divided in two doses per day?

Hello Nebula,

Did you ever get to creating a “home brew” combining androstanalone / testosterone powder in combination with Georgi’s pansterone product? If so, how did it go? Plus how easy was it to dissolve the androstanalone/ testosterone into a full bottle of pansterone?

Thanks!

@Nebula

 

[Nebula]

Hello Nebula,

Did you ever get to creating a “home brew” combining androstanalone / testosterone powder in combination with Georgi’s pansterone product? If so, how did it go? Plus how easy was it to dissolve the androstanalone/ testosterone into a full bottle of pansterone?

Thanks!

@Nebula

Nope haven’t got around to it. I would still like to try dissolving 180-360 mg T or DHT per bottle though (0.5 to 1 mg per drop) Haidut said that should be possible.

 

[Mitchell777]

Nope haven’t got around to it. I would still like to try dissolving 180-360 mg T or DHT per bottle though (0.5 to 1 mg per drop) Haidut said that should be possible.

Thank you for the quick response.

Hopefully @haidut can completely clarify this soon.

 

[Soren]

Been doing this topically on my gentials, 2mg of Androsterone and 2mg of DHEA and all I can say is wow. Never felt more frisky in my life. Covid pandemic doesn't exactly help haha.

Any risk of androgen suppression at this dose?