Human study — Betaine (TMG) nearly doubles total testosterone & lowers cortisol by 30%

[youngsinatra]

Would like to hear your thoughts on this one:

Effects of short-term betaine supplementation on muscle endurance and indices of endocrine function following acute high-intensity resistance exercise in young athletes - PubMed

Two weeks of betaine supplementation improved upper- and lower-body muscle endurance and influenced indices of endocrine function following an acute session of high-intensity RE in adolescent handball players.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

The total testosterone in the betaine group is around 1500ng/dL.

 

[TheSir]

Betaine has clear anti-stress properties in my experience. I'm taking 3g a day.

 

[Ahmed ELH]

Is the increase of testosterone caused directly by Betaine or is it caused by the cortisol lowering effect? That's the real deal here.

 

[youngsinatra]

Betaine has clear anti-stress properties in my experience. I'm taking 3g a day.

Thanks for sharing your experience!

 

[youngsinatra]

Is the increase of testosterone caused directly by Betaine or is it caused by the cortisol lowering effect? That's the real deal here.

Hard to say. Could very well be the cortisol lowering effect. I have found a study where they tried 600mg of phospatidylserine (a known cortisol lowering substance) and it raised testosterone significantly aswell, alongside lowering cortisol. (The effects of phosphatidylserine on endocrine response to moderate intensity exercise)

But betaine is pretty damn cheap, safe, good for the liver function and methylation. I didn’t know that it has cortisol lowering properties before.

 

[Ahmed ELH]

Hard to say. Could very well be the cortisol lowering effect. I have found a study where they tried 600mg of phospatidylserine (a known cortisol lowering substance) and it raised testosterone significantly aswell, alongside lowering cortisol. (The effects of phosphatidylserine on endocrine response to moderate intensity exercise)


But betaine is pretty damn cheap, safe, good for the liver function and methylation. I didn’t know that it has cortisol lowering properties before.

Interesting, for sure, Phosphatidylserine is great at reducing stress but man it's so expensive
Betain looks like a great alternative.

 

[Peater]

Interesting, for sure, Phosphatidylserine is great at reducing stress but man it's so expensive
Betain looks like a great alternative.

If you are doing high dose B1 it is worth considering also due to the methylation youngsinatra mentioned. I have to admit I don't have a compregensive picture in my head of how it all ties together but I think methylation, histamines and choline are all inter-related.

 

[youngsinatra]

If you are doing high dose B1 it is worth considering also due to the methylation youngsinatra mentioned. I have to admit I don't have a compregensive picture in my head of how it all ties together but I think methylation, histamines and choline are all inter-related.

Betaine can be used as an emergency methyl donor to regenerate SAMe from homocysteine when the B12/folate cycle is dysfunctional.

 

[GTW]

Timing? Betaine with or before food?
Betaine (HCl) is dimethylglycine?

 

[Elie]

I wonder what the effect would be on mid aged folks. The increase will likely be smaller.

 

[SaltiestSardine]

Interesting, for sure, Phosphatidylserine is great at reducing stress but man it's so expensive
Betain looks like a great alternative.

You can get it in abundance from Mackerel. No need for a supplement

 

[Texon]

Betaine can be used as an emergency methyl donor to regenerate SAMe from homocysteine when the B12/folate cycle is dysfunctional.

It also enhances kidney health and lean muscle mass as well.

 

[DGSTLX]

Timing? Betaine with or before food?
Betaine (HCl) is dimethylglycine?

Best in the middle of your food intake. HCI is hydrochloride, the same acid that our body produces during digestion.
If you buy it with pepsin, you should only take it during high protein meals.

Also start with small doses and progress if you feel no side effects.

 

[GTW]

My mistake.
Choline is tetramethylglycine.
Betaine, trimethylglycine. Betaine HCl has substitution at one choline methyl position.
Dimethylglycine has two methyl groups.
Similar but not equivalent functionally.
Interesting that the digestive function of betaine HCl is more than HCl alone.

 

[Krigeren]

OP is talking about Betaine Anhydrous, not Betaine HCL.

 

[GTW]

OP is talking about Betaine Anhydrous, not Betaine HCL.

True, so what?
Betaine HCl releases HCl and remains Betaine until absorbed? Two for one!

 

[Krigeren]

True, so what?
Betaine HCl releases HCl and remains Betaine until absorbed? Two for one!

In this context, primarily b/c Betaine Anhydrous is the one used in the study (Betaine Anhydrous Trimethylglycine Powder, Bulk Supplements Inc., NV, USA). Also the two are frequently confused and someone new to Betaine HCL could be in for a world of hurt if they take a bunch of it and are not familiar with the potential discomfort of taking Betaine HCL. Usually it takes 20-30 posts for a thread to go off the rails around here, this one did it in less than 10.

 

[Mauritio]

Interesting study. Subjects were really young ,so that should be factored in. But Id be interested in hearing other people's experience.

 

[pubh12]

@youngsinatra

Do you know much about the conversion of Choline to betaine in the body? I was reading about how cholines primary metabolic process is making betaine, and then the rest to cycle to acetylcholine and something else. But it seemed the only way it would be excreted would be after the betaine conversion. I read that pqq is the cofactor to the enzyme Choline dehydrogenase which makes this conversion to betaine. Maybe this is a stupid question- but is it possible for choline to build up in the body and not produce betaine if you don’t have adequate supply of PPQ ?

 

[youngsinatra]

@youngsinatra

Do you know much about the conversion of Choline to betaine in the body? I was reading about how cholines primary metabolic process is making betaine, and then the rest to cycle to acetylcholine and something else. But it seemed the only way it would be excreted would be after the betaine conversion. I read that pqq is the cofactor to the enzyme Choline dehydrogenase which makes this conversion to betaine. Maybe this is a stupid question- but is it possible for choline to build up in the body and not produce betaine if you don’t have adequate supply of PPQ ?

Thats a very good question. I haven’t read deeply on the endogenous metabolism of betaine yet.