CortiNon - Liquid Progesterone/DHEA Mix

[haidut]

This product does not really need any introduction to anybody familiar with Peat's work. I have wanted to release it for a long time but over the last few months the studies I found related to the anabolic and anticatabolic effects of progesterone, combined with the fact that Peat has told quite a few people over email that he used this combination of steroids, convinced me that it is worth it.
Unlike other products, there won't be as many references listed in support of this product but I think even the few ones below are enough to give an idea about its properties.
The name CortiNon was coined due to the known main effects of both progesterone and DHEA - i.e. antagonism to cortisol, both at the receptor level (progesterone) and functionally (progesterone & DHEA).

The units listed on the label are just for measurement purposes. They do not indicate suggested or optimal dose. Please note that similar to the products sold by companies like BluePeptides, this product is for lab/research use only. The product can be ordered from the link below:
www.idealabsdc.com/lab

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CortiNon is a combination of the steroids progesterone and DHEA, which have a number of desirable properties as demonstrated by numerous studies - i.e. anti-glucocorticoid, anti-inflammatory, anti-endotoxin, anti-viral, anti-mutagenic, antimicrobial, anti-cancer, anxiolytic, antidepressant, and generally anti-aging.

Drops per container: about 360
Each drop contains the following ingredients:

Progesterone (USP): 3mg
DHEA (USP): 1mg

Other ingredients: add product to shopping cart to see info
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References:

Anti-aging

KMUD: 1-18-2019 Skin Cancer Part 3

Direct MP3 link | Podcast setup This one partly continues the skin cancer topic, but also has some intriguing stuff on genetic material and viruses. The forum software is being grumpy, so try the direct MP3 link above until I can get the attachment up. Donate to support KMUD Community Radio

raypeatforum.com

Topical DHEA Has Potent Anti-aging Effects On Human Skin

I often get emails in regards to possible interventions with anti-aging effects on skin. The study I usually quote is an old one (circa 1967) that did extensive tests on 200+ people with age range of 57-88 years residing in a retirement home, and demonstrated that topical testosterone (1%) cream...

raypeatforum.com

Effects and side-effects of 2% progesterone cream on the skin of peri- and postmenopausal women: results from a double-blind, vehicle-controlled, randomized study - PubMed

The results of this study demonstrate that topical 2% progesterone acts primarily in increasing elasticity and firmness in the skin of peri- and postmenopausal women. These effects in combination with good tolerability make progesterone a possible treatment agent for slowing down the ageing...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Anti-Catabolic / Myotrophic / Androgenic
1. Progesterone
The Anti-cortisol Mechanism Of Progesterone
The Anabolic Effects Of Progesterone
Progesterone Is Androgenic
Progesterone Is As Anabolic For Muscle As Testosterone (in Women)

2. DHEA
DHEA, In Low Doses, Directly Inhibits Cortisol Synthesis
DHEA Enhances Cortisol Degradation
DHEA Has Very Similar Anabolic Activity To DHT
DHEA, a selective glucocorticoid receptor antagonist: its role in immune system regulation and metabolism. - PubMed - NCBI
Low-dose DHEA Inhibits Aromatase By 35% And Endotoxin Blocks That Effect

3. Combination
The Requirements For An Optimal Anticatabolic / Anabolic Substance (progesterone + DHEA)
Ray Peat Email Advice Depository
6-Ketoprogesterone and its biological actions. - PubMed - NCBI
"...The results are summarized in Table 6. The extracts of the samples, in which progesterone and dehydroepiandrosterone were used as substrate resulted in the strongest hypertrophy of the preputial gland and had the strongest myotrophic action of all. Both of the actions of the products which come from the incubation of the villus with 17(a)-hydroxyprogesterone were much weaker."

 

[milk_lover]

Thanks man! This combination of steroids (progesterone+DHEA) has been so much effective at negating work-related stress that I can't help but wonder that men need progesterone just like women. I take at least 2 drops of Progestene (3.33 mg progesterone) and one drop Pansterone (1.25 mg DHEA/preg) almost daily, so this new product I think will be more practical for me. How do you feel haidut after you take some of this product?

 

[aguilaroja]

The name (CortiNon) was coined due to the known main effects of both progesterone and DHEA - i.e. antagonism to cortisol, both at the receptor level (progesterone) and functionally (progesterone & DHEA)...

Was the name CushingQuashing too many syllables ? :-}

 

[haidut]

Thanks man! This combination of steroids (progesterone+DHEA) has been so much effective at negating work-related stress that I can't help but wonder that men need progesterone just like women. I take at least 2 drops of Progestene (3.33 mg progesterone) and one drop Pansterone (1.25 mg DHEA/preg) almost daily, so this new product I think will be more practical for me. How do you feel haidut after you take some of this product?

Proper male sexual function absolutely requires progesterone as this is the steroid that is the main endogenous antagonist to cortisol at the "receptor" level. You can have high T levels but if cortisol is also high, then T will not only go towards estrogen due to high aromatase activity, but it will also not do much for sexual activity. And of course, brain function cannot be optimal without progesterone. Up until the mid-teens males and females produce equal amount of progesterone. Here are some things to consider.
Does male sexual behavior require progesterone? - PubMed - NCBI
Progesterone reduces erectile dysfunction in sleep-deprived spontaneously hypertensive rats
Influence of progesterone on sexual performance in male rats. - PubMed - NCBI
http://www.bio.utexas.edu/faculty/lizard/public/RegulationOfMaleSexual.pdf

I get the typical anti-cortisol effects - quick reduction of belly area within 30min of using, relaxation but no sedation (possible due to DHEA balancing the sedation of progesterone), improved muscle tone, reduced hunger and ability to go longer without food, and of course higher temps.

 

[haidut]

Was the name CushingQuashing too many syllables ? :-}

Yes, but I like it anyways
I would have gone with CortiBan but there is unfortunately a (defunct) vitamin product which used the same name so I did not want our to get confused with it. If you have other suggestions I am all ears though.

 

[Koveras]

Thanks man! This combination of steroids (progesterone+DHEA) has been so much effective at negating work-related stress that I can't help but wonder that men need progesterone just like women. I take at least 2 drops of Progestene (3.33 mg progesterone) and one drop Pansterone (1.25 mg DHEA/preg) almost daily, so this new product I think will be more practical for me. How do you feel haidut after you take some of this product?

Proper male sexual function absolutely requires progesterone as this is the steroid that is the main endogenous antagonist to cortisol at the "receptor" level. You can have high T levels but if cortisol is also high, then T will not only go towards estrogen due to high aromatase activity, but it will also not do much for sexual activity. And of course, brain function cannot be optimal without progesterone. Up until the mid-teens males and females produce equal amount of progesterone. Here are some things to consider.
Does male sexual behavior require progesterone? - PubMed - NCBI
Progesterone reduces erectile dysfunction in sleep-deprived spontaneously hypertensive rats
Influence of progesterone on sexual performance in male rats. - PubMed - NCBI
http://www.bio.utexas.edu/faculty/lizard/public/RegulationOfMaleSexual.pdf

I get the typical anti-cortisol effects - quick reduction of belly area within 30min of using, relaxation but no sedation (possible due to DHEA balancing the sedation of progesterone), improved muscle tone, reduced hunger and ability to go longer without food, and of course higher temps.

It seems that dopamine exerts some of it's pro-libido effects through the progesterone receptor as well.

Not sure about the use of the word 'unoccupied' receptor in the last study here.

Reproduction. 2001 Dec;122(6):847-55.
Ligand-independent activation of progestin receptors: relevance for female sexual behaviour.
Auger AP1.
Traditionally, steroid receptors were believed to be activated only by ligand binding; however, recent studies indicate that steroid receptors can also be activated by mechanisms that do not require ligand, referred to as ligand-independent activation. Specifically, progestin receptors can be activated in vitro and in vivo after treatment with neurotransmitters, such as dopamine, in the absence of progesterone. Furthermore, mating-related stimuli can also lead to ligand-independent activation of progestin receptors in female rat brain. This finding indicates that environmental stimuli can influence steroid receptor-dependent processes in the absence of circulating hormone. This review focuses on studies indicating that progestin receptors can be activated in the absence of progesterone to influence neuronal response and sexual behaviour in rodents.

Science. 1994 Aug 26;265(5176):1246-9.
Convergent pathways for steroid hormone- and neurotransmitter-induced rat sexual behavior.
Mani SK1, Allen JM, Clark JH, Blaustein JD, O'Malley BW.
Estrogen and progesterone modulate gene expression in rodents by activation of intracellular receptors in the hypothalamus, which regulate neuronal networks that control female sexual behavior. However, the neurotransmitter dopamine has been shown to activate certain steroid receptors in a ligand-independent manner. A dopamine receptor stimulant and a D1 receptor agonist, but not a D2 receptor agonist, mimicked the effects of progesterone in facilitating sexual behavior in female rats. The facilitory effect of the neurotransmitter was blocked by progesterone receptor antagonists, a D1 receptor antagonist, or antisense oligonucleotides to the progesterone receptor. The results suggest that in rodents neurotransmitters may regulate in vivo gene expression and behavior by means of cross-talk with steroid receptors in the brain.

Mol Endocrinol. 1996 Dec;10(12):1728-37.
Dopamine requires the unoccupied progesterone receptor to induce sexual behavior in mice.
Mani SK1, Allen JM, Lydon JP, Mulac-Jericevic B, Blaustein JD, DeMayo FJ, Conneely O, O'Malley BW.
Using the recently generated mutant mice strain (PRKO) carrying a null mutation for the progesterone receptor (PR) gene by gene targeting, we examined the critical role of PR as a coordinator of key regulatory events involved in the steroid hormone and dopamine-facilitated sexual behavior in female mice. In vitro one-point binding analyses of estradiol benzoate (EB)-induced cellular PRs and immunohistochemistry of PR in the mediobasal hypothalamus demonstrated a reduction in binding in the homozygous females, equivalent to background levels seen in EB-unresponsive tissue. The biochemical findings correlated well with the behavioral observations, with the wild type females exhibiting high levels of lordosis, while the homozygous females showed minimal lordosis in response to mating by male mice. As a critical validation of our earlier studies on ligand-independent activation of PRs by dopamine, we examined the facilitation of sexual behavior by a dopamine agonist in the null mutants. Wild type females having the full complement of PRs exhibited high levels of lordosis, while the homozygous females showed minimal lordosis in response to dopamine. To determine whether this reduced response was due to a general lack of ability to express lordosis, mice were treated with another neurotransmitter, serotonin. No significant difference in the serotonin-facilitated lordosis response was observed between the wild type and the homozygous females. We conclude that multiple signal transduction pathways coexist in the neuroendocrine system for reproductive behavior, with PR acting as a transcriptional mediator for dopamine, as well as progesterone, to achieve integration of neural communication in the central nervous system.

 

[ubiety]

Ordered. What's the best time of day to take this - am, pm, divided between both? I sleep fine on Progestene before bed, but don't know about DHEA. I am subject to insomnia.

 

[Warrior_]

[QUOTE="Haidut
I get the typical anti-cortisol effects - quick reduction of belly area within 30min of using, relaxation but no sedation (possible due to DHEA balancing the sedation of progesterone), improved muscle tone, reduced hunger and ability to go longer without food, and of course higher temps.[/QUOTE]

I get similar effects combining androsterone (4 drops) and pansterone (4 drops) in the morning, with the difference that rather relaxation I feel more focused, alert, and aggressive. All other points (increased muscle tone, reduced hunger, leaning out, higher temps etc.) are the same.

However I am interested in this new product too

 

[Sheik]

Is this vehicle as effective as vitamin E?

 

[haidut]

It seems that dopamine exerts some of it's pro-libido effects through the progesterone receptor as well.

Not sure about the use of the word 'unoccupied' receptor in the last study here.

Reproduction. 2001 Dec;122(6):847-55.
Ligand-independent activation of progestin receptors: relevance for female sexual behaviour.
Auger AP1.
Traditionally, steroid receptors were believed to be activated only by ligand binding; however, recent studies indicate that steroid receptors can also be activated by mechanisms that do not require ligand, referred to as ligand-independent activation. Specifically, progestin receptors can be activated in vitro and in vivo after treatment with neurotransmitters, such as dopamine, in the absence of progesterone. Furthermore, mating-related stimuli can also lead to ligand-independent activation of progestin receptors in female rat brain. This finding indicates that environmental stimuli can influence steroid receptor-dependent processes in the absence of circulating hormone. This review focuses on studies indicating that progestin receptors can be activated in the absence of progesterone to influence neuronal response and sexual behaviour in rodents.

Science. 1994 Aug 26;265(5176):1246-9.
Convergent pathways for steroid hormone- and neurotransmitter-induced rat sexual behavior.
Mani SK1, Allen JM, Clark JH, Blaustein JD, O'Malley BW.
Estrogen and progesterone modulate gene expression in rodents by activation of intracellular receptors in the hypothalamus, which regulate neuronal networks that control female sexual behavior. However, the neurotransmitter dopamine has been shown to activate certain steroid receptors in a ligand-independent manner. A dopamine receptor stimulant and a D1 receptor agonist, but not a D2 receptor agonist, mimicked the effects of progesterone in facilitating sexual behavior in female rats. The facilitory effect of the neurotransmitter was blocked by progesterone receptor antagonists, a D1 receptor antagonist, or antisense oligonucleotides to the progesterone receptor. The results suggest that in rodents neurotransmitters may regulate in vivo gene expression and behavior by means of cross-talk with steroid receptors in the brain.

Mol Endocrinol. 1996 Dec;10(12):1728-37.
Dopamine requires the unoccupied progesterone receptor to induce sexual behavior in mice.
Mani SK1, Allen JM, Lydon JP, Mulac-Jericevic B, Blaustein JD, DeMayo FJ, Conneely O, O'Malley BW.
Using the recently generated mutant mice strain (PRKO) carrying a null mutation for the progesterone receptor (PR) gene by gene targeting, we examined the critical role of PR as a coordinator of key regulatory events involved in the steroid hormone and dopamine-facilitated sexual behavior in female mice. In vitro one-point binding analyses of estradiol benzoate (EB)-induced cellular PRs and immunohistochemistry of PR in the mediobasal hypothalamus demonstrated a reduction in binding in the homozygous females, equivalent to background levels seen in EB-unresponsive tissue. The biochemical findings correlated well with the behavioral observations, with the wild type females exhibiting high levels of lordosis, while the homozygous females showed minimal lordosis in response to mating by male mice. As a critical validation of our earlier studies on ligand-independent activation of PRs by dopamine, we examined the facilitation of sexual behavior by a dopamine agonist in the null mutants. Wild type females having the full complement of PRs exhibited high levels of lordosis, while the homozygous females showed minimal lordosis in response to dopamine. To determine whether this reduced response was due to a general lack of ability to express lordosis, mice were treated with another neurotransmitter, serotonin. No significant difference in the serotonin-facilitated lordosis response was observed between the wild type and the homozygous females. We conclude that multiple signal transduction pathways coexist in the neuroendocrine system for reproductive behavior, with PR acting as a transcriptional mediator for dopamine, as well as progesterone, to achieve integration of neural communication in the central nervous system.

How interesting! Thanks so much.
So, dopamine is an endogenous ligand for PR? No wonder Peat likes both and has been writing about them for so long. It would also explain why dopamine agonists are useful for breast cancer and other hyperestrogenic conditions like gyno. I wonder if serotonin is a ligan for the estrogen and cortisol receptors... Do you have anything on that?

 

[haidut]

Ordered. What's the best time of day to take this - am, pm, divided between both? I sleep fine on Progestene before bed, but don't know about DHEA. I am subject to insomnia.

I don't think it causes insomnia, at least not in my case. It is less sedating than pure progesterone though. So, I think it can be taken at any time but as @Koveras said is progesterone and dopamine upregulate each other's function and this combination is dopaminergic then it may be best to take in the morning.

 

[haidut]

I get similar effects combining androsterone (4 drops) and pansterone (4 drops) in the morning, with the difference that rather relaxation I feel more focused, alert, and aggressive. All other points (increased muscle tone, reduced hunger, leaning out, higher temps etc.) are the same.

However I am interested in this new product too

Great, thanks for sharing. Have you done any labs while taking androsterone and Pansterone?

 

[haidut]

Is this vehicle as effective as vitamin E?

The studies I have seen with the SFA ester were specifically on transdermal absorption of progesterone and it was as effective as DMSO. I don't think it has the steroid potentiating effects of DMSO, but it should give better absorption than vitamin E (which has not been tested formally bu Peat claims is about 25%).

 

[Wagner83]

I get the typical anti-cortisol effects - quick reduction of belly area within 30min of using, relaxation but no sedation (possible due to DHEA balancing the sedation of progesterone), improved muscle tone, reduced hunger and ability to go longer without food, and of course higher temps.

This is one of the things I find hard to see as objective marker, increased hunger is a sign of increased metabolism but increased hunger is a sign of higher cortisol. Same when you said feeling cold means one has higher temperature but people reported the opposite more often, or faster pulse may be cause by improved thyroid or stress hormones.

Out of curiosity why is progesterone for lab research while pregnenolone and dhea are not?

 

[haidut]

This is one of the things I find hard to see as objective marker, increased hunger is a sign of increased metabolism but increased hunger is a sign of higher cortisol. Same when you said feeling cold means one has higher temperature but people reported the opposite more often, or faster pulse may be cause by improved thyroid or stress hormones.

Out of curiosity why is progesterone for lab research while pregnenolone and dhea are not?

The effects of cortisol could go either way. It's typical effect is usually suppression of hunger due to it elevating blood sugar. As far as temps, when I say feeling cold I mean extremities not core temps, which as you noted are usually higher when somebody feels cold.
The difference in status is due to the fact that progesterone is not really a dietary supplement under FDA regulations (unlike pregnenolone and DHEA). In some states there has even been enforcement against companies selling progesterone. It happened at the state level, but still the legal rationale given was that progesterone is a steroid with dangerous health effects. California is one such state.

 

[dand]

Damn Californians :). I was under the impression that pregnenolone mostly metabolized into progesterone. Like as much as 80%. How distinct are the effects from pansterone and CortiNon? Seems like they would be very similar.

 

[haidut]

Damn Californians :). I was under the impression that pregnenolone mostly metabolized into progesterone. Like as much as 80%. How distinct are the effects from pansterone and CortiNon? Seems like they would be very similar.

Personally, I find Pansterone to be much more androgenic and muscle enhancing, while CortiNon to be mostly anti-catabolic and some mental benefits as well. CortiNon shrinks my belly pretty quickly when I am stressed while Pansterone makes me look buff.

 

[Jez]

A quick question for females @haidut With progest-e there is that initial phase of higher doses that they say has to be done to avoid aromatization of progesterone to estro. What would happen with the smaller doses of this product for girls if not currently taking a progesterone product, would it be fine to just use small doses or would they have to do the initial doses of plain progest-e for instance and then continue with this product? Thanks mate. Looks like another cracking product!

 

[dand]

Nice :).

Personally, I find Pansterone to be much more androgenic and muscle enhancing, while CortiNon to be mostly anti-catabolic and some mental benefits as well. CortiNon shrinks my belly pretty quickly when I am stressed while Pansterone makes me look buff.

Nice. Thanks. Looking forward to giving it a shot

 

[RedMars]

Haidut I’m a little confused on how lowering cortisol has made it easier for you to go for a while without food. Wouldn’t lowering cortisol limit gluconeogenesis from muscle tissue making you burn glycogen faster and then you’d get hungry and tired more quickly?

I know there are various complicated pathways for glucose and cortisol but I guess I’m asking if you’re warmer and with lower cortisol, what are you burning for energy and where is it coming from?