Achilles Reflex Test Used To Diagnose Hypothyroidism

[narouz]

Also, keep in mind that is Barnes and not Peat. I think that Barnes says:
Barnes says later " And there is no risk of excessive thyroid dosage as long as basal temperature does not exceed 98.2."He also says that the thyroid gland will not decrease its normal function unless basal temp is maintained for some time above the upper limit of normal." Also, remember - this is underarm temp which would be lower than an oral reading. So I believe that the oral reading is around 98.6 and he is saying we would have to stay above that for some time to effect function.

ARK, to digress a little bit,
I know you're a Peat practitioner of some sort:
do you know how to do that Achilles Reflex Test Peat extolls?
I want someone to do that to me.
I asked my slightly hip, somewhat alternative doc
about reflexes and hypothyroidism,
but he did the tests where you strike the knee and the upper forearm...

 

[ARK]

The Achilles Reflex Test- The other ones don't tell you much. If it is gently hit- your achilles tendon should bounce up and immediately return to normal with no hesitation-If your metabolism is running smoothly.

 

[narouz]

This description of the test would not seem to be correct
according to the way I remember Peat describing it, right...?

I remember reading Peat describing the test,
or maybe it was in an interview,
and as I recall Peat focused upon the motion of the foot & toes
after the initial strike and jerk...yes?
...How slowly or quickly the toes/foot returns to the normal (pre-strike) position?

I remember Peat saying the giveaway for hypothyroidism
is that the hypothyroid person's foot/toes will return like an automatic pneumatic door,
very slowly and gradually.

Or maybe that "pneumatic" motion was how the foot/toes move immediately upon being struck...?

But to return to the video:
I don't think Peat would want the therapist holding the foot/toes
like the guy in the video is doing...would he?

 

[narouz]

This would seem more like it...



...but: which motion is supposed to be like the "automatic pneumatic door"?
The initial jerk immediately at being struck?
Or the return motion after the first twitch/jerk?

 

[ARK]

right!

 

[ARK]

I believe it is : the return motion after the first twitch/jerk.

 

[ARK]

I have heard that even Ray does not pass the test every time.. so go easy on yourselves.

 

[narouz]

Well, here is an Achilles Tendon Reflex test specifically for diagnosis of hypothyroidism.
A little different.
But in this video the doctor places emphasis on the slow return ("pneumatic")
after the initial jerk.

 

[narouz]

right!

Okay, thanks ARK!

 

[narouz]

I have heard that even Ray does not pass the test every time.. so go easy on yourselves.

Oops, already hacked clean through my tendon. Ouch!

 

[narouz]

http://www.functionalps.com/blog/2011/12/05/achilles-tendon-reflex/

Now here's a little video from Functional Performance Systems,
a very Peaty site.

It clearly shows the test,
but doesn't explain whether what we're seeing is a hypothyroid response
or a normal response.

But it does include a long Peat quotation on the subject:

One of the oldest tests for hypothyroidism was the Achilles tendon reflex test in which the rate of relaxation of the calf muscle corresponds to thyroid function–the relaxation is slow in hypothyroid people. Water, sodium, and calcium are more slowly expelled by the hypothyroid muscle. Exactly the same slow relaxation occurs in the hypothyroid heart muscle, contributing to heart failure, because the semi-contracted heart can’t receive as much blood as the normally relaxed heart. The hypothyroid blood vessels are unable to relax properly, contributing to hypertension. Hypothyroid nerves don’t easily return to their energized relaxed state, leading to insomnia, parasthesias, movement disorders, and nerves that are swollen and very susceptible to pressure damage. -Ray Peat, PhD

So, as you confirm ARK, it is the"rate of relaxation of the calf muscle"
we are looking for.

So I guess it would be helpful to know what a normal reflex looks like.

 

[narouz]

http://www.turner-white.com/memberfile.php?PubCode=hp_jan04_thyroid.pdf

This Achilles Reflex Test used to diagnose hypothyroidism is also known as "Woltman's Sign."

 

[ARK]

J Assoc Physicians India. 1990 Mar;38(3):201-3.
Ankle reflex photomotogram in thyroid dysfunctions.
Khurana AK, Sinha RS, Ghorai BK, Bihari N.
The tap to half relaxation time of tendon achilles reflex was measured in thirty control subjects, forty-five thyrotoxic and sixty hypothyroid patients. The half relaxation time in the control males and females was 279.33 +/- 76.39 msec and 320.00 +/- 52.37 msec. respectively. In thyrotoxic males and females the half relaxation time was 256.67 +/- 31.62 msec (P less than 0.01) and 252.50 +/- 47.68 msec (P less than 0.01) respectively. Amongst the hypothyroid male and female patients the half relaxation time was 405.0 +/- 35.56 msec (P less than 0.01) and 422.5 +/- 115.36 (P less than 0.01) respectively. As all these values were statistically significant, we consider the photomotographic measurement of ankle reflex as an important aid to the diagnosis of thyroid hormone imbalances.

get out your timer! :?

 

[charlie]

I have split this topic off into its own thread.

 

[ARK]

I had time to watch the video: the test is showing a HYPO thyroid. So there you go!

 

[nwo2012]

Im ordering myself a reflex hammer right now.

 

[charlie]

Prestige Taylor Percussion Hammer with Stealth Black Head

 

[nwo2012]

Prestige Taylor Percussion Hammer with Stealth Black Head

Yes that looks like the one I ordered but not from US.

 

[narouz]

Prestige Taylor Percussion Hammer with Stealth Black Head

Yes that looks like the one I ordered but not from US.

nwo2012-
Did you ever get your Stealth Hammer?
Put yer Achilles to the test...? :)

 

[Lew VanOsdel MD]

Could anyone tell me how to obtain a device that accurately measures the Achilles-tendon-reflex or another one. I have heard there is a device that measures the bracho-radialis and converts to an Achilles equivalent through a computer program. Can one of these instruments be purchased for a reasonable price? Please provide any phone numbers or websites.